Curse

Llewin · Mar 27, 2006, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Originally, I designed this build as a N/A, but I was forced to change it to A/N due to the need to put points in critical strikes. I'd like some more input on it because I feel it can definitly be improved.

A/N build (Killer Lich):

Attributes
Critical strikes: 10 +1 + 1 = 12
Dagger Mastery: 10 + 3 = 13
Blood Magic: 10
Death Magic: 5

Skills
Golden Lotus Strike
Black Lotus Strike
Critical Eye
Life Syphon
Well of Blood
Demonic Flesh
Awaken the Blood
Aura of the Lich {E}

Equipment
ANYTHING THAT MORE ENERGY (need to use daggers though)

Strategy
When using this build, it is highly recommended NOT to be fighting enemies that spam enchantment removal spells or cannot be the target of hexes (like the Blessed Griffon). Before you eneter combat, cast Awaken the Blood (AtB), followed by Aura of the Lich (AoL), and finally Demonic Flesh (DF). Hit the nearest enemy with Life Syphon (LS) and switch targets to the next closest one with LS. Wash, rinse, repeat until all the enemies that you have just aggroed have a LS on them. Attck the one that you first targeted and use Golden Lotus Strike (GLS) and Black Lotus Strike (BLS) to regain your energy. The object now is to maintain your hexes and enchantment by recasting them at regular intervals. Whenever an enemy dies, cast Well of Blood (WoB) for even more regen. If you find yourself running low on energy, you can stop casting DF, but every time you can renew AoB, you should. ABOVE ALL ELSE MAKE CERTAIN THAT YOU ARE CONSTANTLY ENCHANTED WITH AoL. The half-damage DOUBLES the Hp worth of your LS and WoB spells.

If anyone has a suggestion to improve this build I'd like to hear them.

Timeless Logic · Mar 27, 2006, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Hey bud, figured I'd lend ya a hand.

A few things that stand out at a glance:

Demonic Flesh is a bad choice for this build. With two sup. runes, you are already short 150 hp, and AtB makes you sacrifice 30% max hp each time. I understand the idea behind Demonic Flesh/AotL, but as a melee character, the risks aren't worth the reward for the assassin. Sure, you halve your max health, and gain more health for a large heal after around 20-25 seconds. However, wouldn't it be better if you didn't sacrifice hp or halve your health at all, and instead incorporated self-heal to keep a larger health pool full at all times? The damage reduction is nice, but with max armor and a larger health pool the damage taken isn't enough to warrant sacrificing all that hp.

Secondly, your skill recharge times are through the roof!

Golden Lotus Strike - 20 seconds, and the energy gain is significantly conditional.
Black Lotus Strike - 30 seconds
Life Siphon - 2 seconds BUT it has an energy cost of 10 (I'll get there in a bit)
Well of Blood - 2 seconds but energy cost of 15 AND a cast time of 2 seconds
Demonic Flesh - 60 seconds
Awaken the Blood - 45 seconds, but with a long duration. The extra hp loss hurts, though.
Aura of the Lich - 20 seconds, which its duration outlasts, but cast time = 2 seconds.

With as short as battles can be in GW, these recharge times could cause problems for you, to say the least. Even if a battle lasted for a long time, however, the constant changes in your hp would most likely cause you to die, and no one likes that.

Now, lets look at those times relative to energy costs:

Golden Lotus Strike - 5e, 20 seconds. A good tradeoff for a lead attack with its stats.

Black Lotus Strike - 10e, 30 seconds, but if you hit a hexed foe, you actually gain over 7 energy. Not bad, but with other energy costs you could burn through that energy in one cast, forcing you to wait 30 seconds to regain another 7+.

Life Siphon - 10e, 2 seconds. Looks very nice. One potential drawback: With an assassin's energy pool, which I believe parallels the ranger's but adds an extra pip of regen, you may run into consumption problems when facing a large group of enemies.

Well of Blood - 15e, 2 seconds. Recharge is really irrelevant here, as a correctly positioned well can last long enough to win a battle. The question is, at 15e, is it worth it?

Demonic Flesh - 5e, 60 seconds. Sure, it won't drain your energy very much, but at 10 blood it will most likely last around 40 seconds, leaving you with ~20 seconds of downtime. The usefulness has already been discussed.

Awaken the Blood - 10e, 45 seconds. With a duration of around 30 seconds at 10 Blood Magic, this skill is worth it for most builds. With Demonic Flesh, however, I'm not so sure.

Aura of the Lich - 10e, 20 seconds. From the standpoint of energy efficiency, this skill passes the test with your current attrib setup.

I just get the sneaky feeling that you will run out of energy before all the pieces of the puzzle can come together. You would make up that energy while waiting for recharge, but ideally the energy costs and recharge would mesh nicely enough to allow for continuous execution of complete combos.

I know I sound like I hate your idea, but that couldn't be further from the truth. I see some weaknesses, but I will be more than happy and in fact would like to help you flesh this out into a balanced and respectable build. I'll work on developing it further, and I'll keep you updated on my progress. Thanks, and good luck!

Timeless

P.S. Sorry for that monster of a post.

Yukito Kunisaki · Mar 28, 2006, 06:11 AM // 06:11

Little note to remember on a 'role' assassin.

The recharge shouldn't matter since you're goal isn't to sit next to an opponent spamming skills crazy style [unless that foe is braindead and decides to ignore you]

I figured with the large recharge skills [that have decent benefits which could be improved come final game], you can run in, unload, run out, wait for a new target of opportunity [aka, a foe weakened by teammates], and run in for the gank...

Sins are best for ganking I'd definitely say so myself...

Lady Lorwinia · Mar 28, 2006, 06:14 AM // 06:14

I don't like it. The main highlight of an assassin is to teleport in do crazy damage, and teleport out when you're squishy and exhausted of energy.

Assassins are already pretty squishy, and you've given him no defensive skills. And the only healing you have is well of blood and life siphon?

That's poor healing.

Llewin · Mar 28, 2006, 01:55 PM // 13:55

Alright, first to respond to Timeless Logic:
1. The recharge times don't affect the spell casting aspect, but you are right, the dagger skills are a problem (if anyone wants to let me know how to better gain energy, Im open to suggestions)
2. I realize that no one likes to sacrifice 30% max Hp AND have -150 Hp, but thats the beauty of AoL; the -150 becomes a mere -75 and the 30% sacrifice is really a 15% sacrifice of Hp. That's not giving up too much health for taking half damage AND having your max hp.
3. After playing an assassin in the event, I realize that I might run out of energy before I can pull off the combo. I am hoping that when factions is released, equipment that gives more energy to assassins can be found.

The build has a few weaknesses, but I think that if the problem with the dagger skills could be fixed (need more energy, less recharge tim) this build could be really good...

To Lady Lorwinia, the POINT of an assassin!? THERE IS NO POINT TO ANY CLASS. Classes are merely means to an objective, their skill sets and abilities can be used any way you want, provided that the build actually works well (I realize that at this point, mine doesn't, but Im trying to fix that). And furthermore, taking half damage IS a defensive skill (I could be wrong, but I think that it qualifiues...) and as for life syphon and well of bllod being weak, you obvioiusly have never been a blood necro. Regardless of the fact that you regen factor is doubled by AoL (since you take half damage, every health point you recover is worth two of any other build), the ability to easily have over of +18 regen when surrounded by foes is invaluable. An assassin that could do that while dealing 20-30 damage with each dagger hit is definitly better than an assassin that warps in, deals 100 dmg and has to run away.

elektra_lucia · Mar 28, 2006, 02:11 PM // 14:11

Quote:

To Lady Lorwinia, the POINT of an assassin!? THERE IS NO POINT TO ANY CLASS. Classes are merely means to an objective,

Pardon me but why are you typing in caps and going on about a ''POINT'' surely you could have just re-read what he/she said?

I personally read this

Quote:

I don't like it. The main highlight of an assassin is to teleport in do crazy damage, and teleport out when you're squishy and exhausted of energy.

to mean that the main thing which attracted him/her to this class was what was mentioned in the quote; therefore, this is merely an opinion and he/she is entitled to that, no?

If no, then who granted you the right to defy who was allowed and not allowed to have an opinion?

.

I re-read over and over where 'Lady Lorwinia' had said "POINT" and I simply could not find it. It is possible he/she edited his/her post before I got a chance to look at the original, that'd screw up most of your last post and it would of been better if they just reposted after yours. If that was the case, sorry for commenting on it.

Llewin · Mar 28, 2006, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Sorry if I can off a little strong, but I was arguing with a friend at the same time I was writing this (He agreed with Lorwinia and I think the two arguements ran together in my head). So I apologize for that, but I refuse to retract my statement that classes are merely a means to an end and builds that use these skills in an a new way should not be disregarded because they do not fit someone's view of what a class should be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Lorwinia

I don't like it. The main highlight of an assassin is to teleport in do crazy damage, and teleport out when you're squishy and exhausted of energy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

who granted you the right to defy who was allowed and not allowed to have an opinion?

.

As to that, I don't know if we're reading the same thing, but that's not an opinion, that's a statement that can be proven or disproven. (The proof is: If the only assassin abilities that are worthwile attempt to teleport in, deal damage, and teleport out then the statement is true.) Even if it was an opinion, I could voice my opinion that it was an uniformed or misguided opinion. To say that no one is allowed to critize another opinion is the same as saying no one is allowed to have one (Please don't argue this with me, I want help on my character build, not a debate on philosophy)

BTW "Defy" is blatantly misused in your post, you might want to fix that...

Timeless Logic · Mar 28, 2006, 04:48 PM // 16:48

My mistake about the recharge times, in my moronic typing frenzy I neglected to discuss teleports. However, I still stand by my points as far as energy management is concerned.

This may simply be my stubbornness, but I just don't feel comfortable with the idea of taking away hp on a char that will see melee combat, even if it only does so via teleportation. The potential damage output from some of the monsters that I saw in the FPE, while counterable, was enough to make me twitch a bit. If anyone can prove me wrong, by all means do so.

Timeless

P.S. I'll talk to you soon about some ideas for this build, but atm, I'm still getting my head around them.

LaserLight · Mar 28, 2006, 09:26 PM // 21:26

Recommend a +15e/-1regen focus for swapping in to help get over the whole cast-Life-Siphon-on-twenty-guys thing.

Also. I get what ye're saying about Aura of the Lich doubling your actual Health and apparent Regen, and I know this. But two Superiors on a sac-happy squishy is just irksome. So I suggest the following:

Subtract the superior Critical Strikes and sub in a minor, and use your swing slot for Critical Eye. That gives you back your regen count and actually gives ye a better chance of pulling that regen off, as well as increasing your damage. This also gives you, under Aura of the Lichness, +150HP back. And nobody can argue with an extra 150HP, however they came around. Especially on something as un-hard as an Assassin.

Llewin · Mar 28, 2006, 10:06 PM // 22:06

I took your suggestion, but saw a way to make it work even better. Death magic can be dropped from 7 to 5 (duration is longer than the recharge time) and your helm can be changed to give critical strikes +1 along with decreasing the superior rune to a minor one. This frees up enough points to squeeze another point into dagger mastery. Once I did that, I found that getting rid of the superior rune really only decreased my critical strikes by one.

Yukito Kunisaki · Mar 29, 2006, 07:13 PM // 19:13

An assassin's role is defined by his/her abilities.

Name me a build where a sin can safely stand next to an enemy and fight for a long extended period of time...

Oh yeah, that's a WARRIOR'S job...

No assassin, i don't care how you build it [since you only have 8 slots], can stand next to a foe for more than 5 seconds [again, unless foe is brain dead] and not get targeted / stuffed by SOMETHING...

Warriors can afford to do that however...

I don't think it's an opinion, the game's mechanic has the FACT that an assassin's best ideal role is to run in, deal xxx amount of damage, and get out before he/she dies... I'll admit, I did create some suicidal assassin builds with little to no defense in mind, but that doesn't change the fact that those builds I made are ok for bursts, horrible / inefficient for longevity, ah well...

70AL anyone? Need I say more?